AnimeNfo

[Thomas(akaTammo) (#57694)]

Alive and kicking!!!!!!!!!!

[Kaj (#32327)]

[charn (#40191)]

[Rosepetals (#42525)]

[Thomas(akaTammo) (#57694)]

AT LAST...

[Chris (#8788)]

Im sorry if I couldn't have responded sooner. I had work and school and this post is being copied/pasted. Lets get down to busniess.

@Thomas(akaTammo)

[Caddberry (#27690)]

Re: Alive and kicking!!!!!!!!!!

[charn (#40191)]

Oh ! I appear to understand that he only wants me to remove his e mail address only as he does not want to receive hate mails ! At least that's how I see his message. Well, if you want me to restore it, tell me.

However, as his e mail has been removed, so you who are reading this might not get parts of his criticism about some statements in my review.. so I will copy / paste my review into this site and highlight the part he does not agree with : It's a very long review (as you can see how much i love this series coz I am trying my best to write and praise this anime as if it's the most beautiful thing in the world..)

here goes my review : If any Elfen lied lovers have not read it yet, enjoy it ! (the parts highlighted are the part he does not agree with my opinion. And if you want to know why he does not agree, read his post.)

[Thomas(akaTammo) (#57694)]

Formalities

[Tabris (#53299)]

I guess I have missed the debate , it looks like its been resolved for now .

[Pantha (#38360)]

Yes, this discussion has the official Panthenian seal of approval. You all are actually talking about the series; some of you, in admirable detail. By Tammo’s request, I am going to put in my fifty cents. And I’ll do it by referring to charn’s review since it’s the last post I read.

[Rosepetals (#42525)]

<sigh> No matter how hard I try I just can’t stay away from this topic for too long…it just pulls me right back in. <sets aside Latin American text and Physiology notes>

@Pantha, Very well written argument, I really enjoyed reading it (I also read your Elfen Lied review, and as much as I liked it…..I didn’t agree with some points….but you have my respect.)

Okay, I’m going to see what I can do with this. First to Pantha’s description, then to Tammo’s recent post. Hopefully I can do all of this within an hour and 30 minutes. <takes a deep breath>

[Kaj (#32327)]

Hmm, okay, time to throw my 2 pence in here. Rather than directly address the issues that has been or is being discussed already, which would mean having to carefully and thoughtfully read through all that's already been said (might take days!!!), I'll just post here what I think of Elfen Lied. This is gonna be pretty much an elaborated version of my review (not really much choice since I can't remember most of the tiny details in the anime, and can't rewatch it since I don't have it anymore. Not that I would choose to watch it again tbh, heh), so I'll probably be a bit short on ammunition...

By the way, most of the time it may seem like the scores I give are skewed considering my reviews. It may look like I'm overly harsh in the reviews. In actual fact, this is because I'm better at making criticsm than making complements. I mean, if there's something I don't like, most of the time I can tell you exactly what it is I didn't like. But if something is good, then, well, it's just good. And often it just comes to that simple fact that it felt good, so I enjoyed watching it. Also, I note that many more posts has been made to this discussion since I started this reply. And a few of the things I've included have already been gone over. But I'm too lazy to hunt down these points and remove them, just bear this in mind when you think "wait a minute, someone covered this point already!" Oh yea, and I better apologise in advance for the colourful language present in this post - I tend to get carried away writing this sort of stuff

Okay here we go...

I don't think Elfen Lied is as bad as Tammo makes it out to be. But it's closer to that than the piece of absolute masterpiece that most people seems to be making it out to be. For me, Elfen Lied is a mediocre, just about watchable anime at best.

First of all, I'd like to say something about the animation and sound. I don't know why people rate the animation for this so highly. I mean, it just seem like another one of those anime that goes for giant-eyed cuteness style. There are millions of this style anime out there, and I'm not a fan of it either. I preferr the cuteness factor toned down a bit, ESPECIALLY with an anime with this horror sort of theme. Also sometimes the ripping apart of limbs etc looked distinctly fake to me - they look like barbie dolls with the arms and legs broken off. The horns also looks like ears The animation isn't BAD either. I like the animation of the vectors and often you can feel the viciousness radiating from some of the scenes, which ups the animation marks.

Music. First impressions of the music is BRILLIANT. The opening theme is the best opening theme I've heard when it comes to anime. But having said that, what else does this anime have to offer in terms of music? Come to think of it, often they just ended up playing different variations of opening theme. Not that I'm saying it's a bad thing, but a anime with outstanding music would have to have a FEW tracks that are distinctly good as opposed to one. And the ending theme sucked. It totally clashed with the style of the opening theme. That kind of sums up the anime for me too. Clash of different styles thrown together and hoped for the best. To conclude... the music on this anime was GOOD, but not ESPECIALLY good.

The music and the story are the best aspects of this anime. Undeniably, I found the story to be quite intriguing. Some promising ideas. But it's not fully developed and has too many holes in it. I'll run off a few examples that I can think of. Bearing in mind I have forgotten most of the details, some of these might not actually be valid - they might be holes in my memory rather than the story hahaha. And one or two ideas I stole from other users

The biggest problem that I had with the story is that it's not complete, not fully explained and not thought about properly. The underlying idea seems to be that these people are mutants. ie they are mutated humans. That's generally associated with genes/effects of radiation and that kind of stuff. Here they associated them with an infectious disease?! And then they go on to talk Lucy being the queen of the mutants? So we end up with an infectious disease that causes radical mutation which also somehow, automatically along the way, manages to create a social structure for the people it infects? It seems to me they've jumbled three different ideas together without thinking it through properly. Had they actually explained it in more detail I might have been more convinced, but as it stands I find it a bit too much to swallow.

When they were talking about the infection, I really thought they were gonna make something of it, and thought "this seems interesting". But no, nothing happened. The guy busted out of the hospital without his b*llux chopped off and, much to my disappointment, didn't turn into a diclouse or spawn any diclonusi either. What a waste of a potential idea. They mainly focuses on the female diclonuses. What about they male ones?? We hardly know anything about them. I've got a an idea as to why they were only focusing almost exclusively on the female of the species, and you can probably guess what it is.

Let's move on to another event. The way Lucy escaped in the beginning seemed ridiculously easy. I mean, you'd expect them to know exactly how dangerous she is and what can harm her... so why the heck are all the guards (who are supposed to be preventing her from escaping) carrying weapons the equivalent to pea-shooters? Surely it would make more sense to arm them with something that can at least injure lucy? As it was they only had one gun between all of them that could get past her defenses - man they must be short on budget.

The story seems to contradict itself at points too. I thought all diclonuses are supposed to be murdering scum. Nana seems to be anything but. I never did figure out just what that research place was meant to be doing. I thought the guy's ultimate plan was to force evolve mankind into diclonuses, but then why did they want to kill baby's born as diclonuses? And what happens to the company in the end? That last question may be answered by a sequel, but most of the others I felt should have been answered in this series.

So what is my point? My point is that I really liked some of the ideas behind the story. But ultimately, I felt it was half baked, and contradicted istelf at times. The impressions I get is that they didn't think it through properly before making a start on this project. Probably too eager to get on with start drawing the nude scenes lol.

when people say that the story is well developed, I can just about take it. After all, it did have its moments, and I thought the way Kouta's past was slowly unravelled was good. However, when people tell me they think the CHARACTERS are well developed, then I start choking a bit. There is no doubt in my mind, that the characters are the biggest weaknesses in this anime. I believe that in general, you can classify characters in anime into 3 types. Realistic characters, believably unrealistic characters, and unbelievably unrealistic characters. Character in the second catergory is probably the most common one in these fictional stories. They are the kind of characters that don't act as real people do, but you can
understand the reasoning behind their decisions, and can accept them as believable FICTIONAL characters. Characters in the third catergory are untolerably unrealistic. Most of the time it's a fine line between the second and third catergory, and it dpends a lot on personal opinion. And my opinion is that a lot of the characters in this anime belongs in the third catergory because of the way they react, the actions they chose to do etc. In a nutshell, most of them act like dummies. I think this was caused by too much "smudging" things over in order to keep the story on track. It's kind of hard to explain what I mean, so I'll illustrate with a couple of examples. In case you haven't noticed yet, I like explaining myself in this fashion

Numero Uno: Taken from my review, this was when Nana turns up at the house with Mayu. They wanted to link 2 events together:

1) Nana meets Lucy once again and attacks her, and

2) Nana gets accepted into the house.

Their dilemma is this: How can Kouta and his cousin accept Nana into the house when she's just suddenly gone psycho and attacked Nyu on sight? Surely not even these people are stupid enough to let Nana join them without a proper explanation for her seemingly unjustified violent actions. Actually, on second thoughts, considering how retarded the characters are, they probably would be stupid enough to do just that, without making it seem too out of place in this anime, but I digress. Anyway, they were either too lazy to think up a believable reason or it was just too hard. So they came up with "because she was hungry..." And lo and behold!!! Kouta and his cousin swallows that bullsh*t whole!!! A strange idea has just cropped up in my head as to exactly how they came up with such an "ingenious" solution. I believe the storyboard team got together and had a session of brainstorming, coming up with a bunch of random solutions to their problem. They went through all of them and decided that none of them really fitted the situation, and so they selected one by that well known random process of "spin the bottle and see which one it points to" and ended up with this. Had the "spin the bottle" game yielded some different result, we may have ended up with one of these scenarios instead: Kouta asks "So why did Nana attack Nyu for apparently no reason". Mayu answers: "Because Nana is tired" or "Because the stars are out tonight" or "Because Nana is left handed", or "Because 1+1=2" or "Because 1+1=27" or "Because she wants to! Because she wants to!" okay I admitt. That last one wasn't my idea entirely, it was adapted from some song lyrics that popped into my head whilst writing this.

Another scene. Lucy and Kouta was on the bus. Lucy has some delusions and start strangling Kouta. So the problem here is this - how can they have this scene and still have those two be friends afterwards? And their solution was... non-existant. They just did some "smudging" and hoped no one noticed hehehe. Kouta simply brushed off this matter as though this was a very small thing. He just sat up again and asked Lucy curiously why she did that. I can't even remember what Lucy said. I think maybe I was laughing so hard I missed what must have been an incredibly clever answer. But clearly, to Kouta, being strangled for no reason is something that happens to him all the time, so it's no big deal. I've said that there are grey areas between the second and third catergory. But SURELY, not one of you can deny that reactions such as this one and the conversation that I mentioned before belong to the UNBELIEVABLY UNREALISTIC catergory? You may be able to overlook it if you were properly enjoy the anime, but surely you can't deny that these are bad flaws in the character development?

Okay I'll just rattle off a few other examples. I remember thinking the way they accepted Lucy's sudden personality change was a bit dodgy - it was like... ooh she talks. oh no she doesnt, lets forget that happened. In fact, under reacting seems to be a special trait of this anime. People see these girls with horns coming out of their heads walking around, and reacts to it as though it's just A LITTLE strange.

If someone asks me to describe the characters in this anime in 2 words, then I'd go for "wooden" and "one dimensional". That someone would probably then tell me "I said describe it in two words not three you tw*t!" But anyway, lets examine some of the characters in more detail.

Kouta: Typical, one dimensional Mr. Nice Guy. He can even forgive someone who killed his parents and sister so easily. I saw that coming a mile off. nothing to see here.

Nana: Sickeningly nice, with her "papa" this "papa" that. One of the only interesting scenes she provided was when she almost turned violent when taunted by that special forces guy. What was his name again? Bando or something. Other than that she is so one dimensional and predictable. And how come someone who's had ALL their limbs ripped off like that managed to survive? The immense bloodloss would have killed her within minutes surely. I went a bit goggle eyed when I realised she was still alive.

Kouta's cousin: I can't even remember her name. I just remembered she likes Kouta, and calls him "baka" all the time. Did she even have a personality?? There might be some incest going on here, but in case I'll give it the benefit of the doubt and assume that they are distant cousins.

Bando: Mr special forces tough guy. Why is he even in a military organisation anyway? He'd been fired long ago for acting like a dumbass. He's like type of guy who takes out his comrades. Oh wait, didn't he do that in the anime? I forget. And just what exactly did he contribute to this anime? I thought at first he was gonna be Lucy's eventual nemesis or something, but no. Turned out he was nothing. Was quite interesting when he became infected, but they must have forgotten about that part of the storyline, as they didn't make anything out of it.

Mayu: My my, how cheerful she is considering her past. She brings a whole new definition to "traumatic experience" - it now means feeling SLIGHTLY sad when you think back upon the incident. Other than that it doesn't seem to have affected her at all. The must have tagged the tragic past story in there as an afterthought, as a kind of "yet another dark side to humanity" example, and didn't bother redesigning the character in order take that into account. When I first saw her story I sympathised with her. But by the end of it I'd almost forgotten about that incident. I blame the character for making me forget. I am also puzzled about just how she managed to survive after she ran away. She also looked suspiciously clean when she was living out in the streets. Oh yea, and that reminds me about the dog. Don't even get me started on the dog...

Dog: Not even dogs act like dogs in this anime. What is a dog's most outstanding characteristic again? Oh yea I remember now... loyalty. This dog abandoned it's owner (who doesn't seem to have mistreated it at all) and follows some random girl it just mets. Hmmmmmmmm...

Lucy: Not so one dimensional. But on the other hand does somethings that I don't really understand. Main thing that bothers me is that she doesn't seem to act consistently. I mean, she started killing people because she thought they were cruel to her and are evil etc. But she also kills people who are nice to her - I remember someone asking her if she was alright in the fair when she was holding her head in her hands. She mercilessly kills her. Okay, I'm thinking... fair enough - so she's made up her mind to kill everyone, regardless. But then, why did she not kill Kurama?? Or, why doesn't she just go around and kill everyone? It's not like she doesn't have the ability. She killed A LOT of people, but I just wonder why she doesn't kill more.

Kurama: Now here was a character that I thought was quite good, or at least, I found quite intersting. Although the realism of his character is debatable, I'd class him under BELIEVABLY UNREALISTIC at least. Why? Because I can understand the reason behind his actions, such as the incident in the hospital about his daughter (that reminds me... I dimly recall thinking that there was so much bloody coming out of his wife that it seemed so fake, just there to shock people). Yes on one hand she is his daughter and he is a father. Therefore the most likely human reaction is to save his daughter. On the other hand, he is also a scientist who does research on diclowns. He knows only too well how dangerous they are to mankind. He strikes me as a very very rational, logical kind of guy, and so his actions there were understandable. I have to admitt his reunion with his daughter in the last episode is very touching. But as by then my opinion of this anime has sunk so low that it didn't really affect me all that much. But yes I admitt that scene was very good.

Okay folks, the next section is on: violence and nudity

They went a little overboard with the violence I reckon. There are some animes that uses violence effectively, an example that comes immediately to mind being Berserk, but this anime isn't one of them. Most of it is understandable but some are clearly just try and shock people as much as possible. You can almost smell the effort they are putting into it into it in order to achieve their purpose. Prime example would be the shooting cannon balls at diclonuses in labs. That was unecessary - I'm sure there are better ways to measure the strength of their vectors other than shooting cannon balls at them. Seems to me they've chosen one of the crudest and unscientific way to go about "research" just cos it makes it more shocking lol. Well anyway. After a couple of episodes the amount of violence pretty much numbs you from further affects, so everything following that was mostly wasted effort. That's why I think this anime didn't use violence effectively.

Next point: Fanservice and nudity. I have to say. I am not a fan of fanservice. I can tolerate a little, but not this much. The amount of nudity etc is just unnecessary. Yes, there are anime out there that has even more, but it's no good saying this is okay because there are even worse animes out there. For example, I disliked the Onegai Twins storyline. But I also think the Furi Kuri one sucked even more, but that fact doesn't automatically make Onegai Twins good. I, too, thought that the nudity in the opening scenes can be thought of as tasteful. It had a very artlike quality to it. However, pretty much everything else isn't tasteful. I mean, one scene had a girl falling over, the action was beautiful captured by an upskirt shot from the "ground to air" cam. How can you class scenes like that anything other than low and cheap? And why are all the diclonuseseses in the research place naked? Do these people not even have the decency to give them clothes? Also, the scenes of Nyu being clothed. All I've got to say for this scene is: there are other, much more innocent ways to display innocence than having someone play with themselves. Why do they choose to use this method? Fanservice. It is true, as charn pointed out, that some of the characters being portayed naked are very young. But why have scenes of them naked at all? Is itt necessary? No. Is it tasteful? No. That leaves just one remaining possibility... The timing of some of the scenes were bad too. There I was, quite enjoying the last couple of episodes - they were rather exciting - and along comes a scene of Kurama's daugher and Nana fighting. Whump... Nana gets hit... and... WHAT???? All her clothes just flies off her body (in slow motion too, I think) as she got hit. At that point I almost fell off my chair laughing. It TOTALLY ruined the mood of the anime. It's this type of thing that horribly devalues this anime for me.

I didn't buy the whole cutness/comedy aspect of it either. It clashes with the dark side that it's trying to show. During the opening credits, the haunting melody in latin made me think it was gonna be kind of gothic horror style show. I was thinking... ooo this looks interesting. But turns out most of the time it's just filled up with cuteness and the kind of silly comedy that I loathe. I think it was a mistake to choose this format for this anime, cos it could have been so much darker and better than what it is.

As for searching for the hidden meanings of this anime, well. I can't really go into that at all because of the simple fact that I don't believe this anime was meant to be incredibly deep. To be honest, the ending just looked like Kouta forgives Lucy, basically. He can't really forgive Nyu cos she hasn't really done anything, so logically speaking it must be Lucy he is
forgiving. I don't think this anime is very deep because, taking into consideration the one dimensional characters, contradictions, half baked ideas, cheap fanservice, sometimes mindless violence and all the other flaws that this anime has, I really, REALLY doubt that the producers put that much deep and hidden messages into this - that would imply they thought this through really really hard, and to me, all signs indicate that this is not a well thought out piece of work. Of course, if you try hard enough you can dig out hidden meanings out of anything, whether they exist or not, and it seems to me this is what is happening with this anime. Basically, I'm saying: Rosepetal#19 I think you're reading too much into this anime. It's probably pointless arguing over this though, because you can say that there are hidden meanings and come up with more deep interpretations, but as I don't believe this anime is that deep, all these would be lost on me as I don't acknowledge the existance of such deep meanings in the anime. I guess it all boils down to difference in opinion, and mine is that this anime isn't as deep as people make it out to be.

Okay I think I'm done.

*the newcomer arrives on the battlefield and immediately (or rather, eventually, after two days) unleashes an attack that he has put all his energy and effort into. Then he collapses with exhaustion, with nothing more to say, no more ace to play...*

ahh screw this... I'm just poaching song lyrics again lol. I better stop before I get sued...

Okay, so there you have it. This is what I've come up with using my limited resources (and a couple of ideas "borrowed" from
other users). I'd like to think I've backed up my opinions with understandable reasoning at least. But even if I haven't, I'll probably be okay since RosePetals1999 is probably too nice to pick it apart anyways hehehehe. To conclude. I couldn't get into the anime and enjoy it with thoughts like "huh? that didn't make sense" "bah I hate this comedy stuff" "God - more cheap fan service", "WHAT? I can't believe that just happened" "omg that felt so fake" "God why are the characters so wooden" etc, running through my head every few minutes or so as I was watching this. I can see why people enjoyed this anime. But I have to say I am sincerely puzzled by why it was this popular. There are animes that, though I don't rate THAT highly myself, I can see why other people likes it so much they think it's the best thing ever, such as Eva, CBB, and even Full Moon to a certain extent. With Elfen Lied it I never did figure it out. The only thing that distinguish this with another anime with huge eyed characters, silly comedy and excessive fan services etc, seems to be the extraordinary amount of violence in it. As an afterthought - if even as generous a reviewer as 19LadiesWithRosePetals can only give this anime 8.3 rating, surely that's an indication that this anime isn't that special after all...

PS I hope you lot take your time reading this so that I don't have to reply too soon.

[charn (#40191)]

According to Thomas's request, I have restored his e mail and corrected some spelling and grammatical errors. (please note that I said 'some', because my grammar is bad as well).

[Tabris (#53299)]

I'm gonna join in on this nice little debate tomorrow night when:

A) It isn't 2:43AM on a school night.
B) I am not tired as hell.

I'll be ready to back up Charn .

[charn (#40191)]

All right, I will try to explain, repeat, to explain my impression about those ‘unrealistic’ aspects you pointed out. Please note, instead of looking at this show objectively, I am going to look at it subjectively. And I am going to describe how I feel about those scenes to you. Not to prove that you are wrong. But to make you realize that those scenes are made for a good reason, and the reason is, they know that the majority of people are going to enjoy the show.

Here I go. And please don’t bite me too hard. I am not a good debater. Never was, and probably never will. But allow me to make my humble opinion. Right, let’s get started !

Firstly, at Thomas’s point.

[Pantha (#38360)]

I'll wait for charn's reply. I have a rebuttal for rose, but I'll keep it short. I'll edit this post later.

[Thomas(akaTammo) (#57694)]

Lucy - Maya - dicloniuses - BANDO AFTER EDITING

[Chris (#8788)]

Im sorry I haven't responded as of latley. Im still writing out a response on Kaj. Most questions and answers will be addressed on him, then i'll move onto maybe Pantha and of course you Thomas. Give me a little more time.

[Kaj (#32327)]

Damn, I was hoping I didn't have to respond, but I'll probably have to respond when chris posts his reply

I have seen chobits, so I can't really compare.

I quite liked the shell incident that charn brought up though. It was one of few incidents that I thought was rather good.

And I agree completely with Tammo on the subject of bando. I briefly went over him in my post, but yes I was trying to point out that as he didn't act like a member of some special forces at all because of his complete lack of discipline. If he was a hitman or something they hired to take out Lucy, then his behaviour would make more sense. But they seem bent on making this bad ass character out of him they forgot he was meant to be a kind of soldier, not just a thug.

PS off topic: Charn you still haven't told me why you thought I was american Please explain as I am very curious

[charn (#40191)]

All right for this post I will reply to Pantha’s opinion.. solely.

[Kaj (#32327)]

I am Chinese. But I've been living in the UK for so long now that my English is now far better than my Chinese ^^.

Okay, a few quick comments on your post.

Your theory on the use of nudity to strengthen the relationship is interesting. I haven't thought about it in that way. However, I still think it was not intended to used in such a fashion - I still think it's just there for cheap thrills. But that's down to a difference in opinion, and I acknowledge that you have made a very good point.

On the point of violence in RK reminiscense. The FIRST time I watched it, I hadn't watched Kenshin the series before. And you know what? I got a bit bored of the violence in it in the latter half of the first episode. I mean - who is this guy? He's just basically going around killing everyone, this is starting to get boring. However, AFTER I watched the series, I watched it in a totally different light. This time I didn't get bored at all. So, yea, it makes a BIG difference what light you see it in. If you've not taken to Elfen Lied a couple of episodes into the series, then the violence will just bore you. And that's what's happened with me.

The Berserk scene you mentioned. Although you think that scene serves no purpose at all. I think it does. I think it generates and impression that matches the title "Berserk" perfectly. It made me admire the iron resolve that Gatts has - the guy is just insane . But anyway, your reaction to it yourself shows that although it may be a scene that serves no purpose (to you), it's a POWERFUL scene. That's what I think the difference in the use of violence between the two anime is. Berserk uses less violence, but uses it effectively to generate more powerful emotions than Elfen Lied does.

I also think that Lucy does have sufficient reason to want to kill. But again, it's down to personal opinion - those reasons obviously doesn't seem to be powerful enough to convince Pantha.

Yes I don't think Elfen Lied has NO substance, I just don't think it has A LOT of substance. Again, a matter of opinion.

I understand why this anime can be well liked. I just don't understand why so many people are hailing it as the best anime ever. I mean, to be good you just have to like it. To be BEST or one of the best, you need something really special. Usually anime with those labells have some outstanding features when viewed objectively, as well as subjectively.

Oh yea, and frankenstein is a classic book by Mary Shelley (is that how you spell her name). I dunno about anime, but various films have been adapted from the book. You might want to read the book if you want the original experience though.

Damn, this discussion is draining all my anime watching time :'(

[Thomas(akaTammo) (#57694)]

Gore - Nudity - Popularity

[Rosepetals (#42525)]

[Thomas(akaTammo) (#57694)]

Lucy - Nana - cemetary

[Kaj (#32327)]

Yay she is back lol.

This is turning into some sort of 6 way battle royale

But I feel that this debate is coming to an end - all the points seem to have been gone over and we're now reached the stage where we're just posting our own opinions

[Rosepetals (#42525)]

I really can't stay away from all of you for too long..lol Thank you! I'm in-between classes at the moment, and I have a test tomorrow and two papers to write over the weekend , so I probably can't contribute much to the discussion other than what I'm doing now, but I will watch this thread of course. Hope you have fun and I'll try to come in when I can.

And yes, Tammo and Pantha, I see your point, now. But, Tammo, I'm using a form of your own phrase against your argument and Pantha's...one time doesn't necessarily explain a whole generalization. That's why I made the statement I did. And I realize my folly with Nana, sorry about that. I stand by inquiry to Pantha, though, I don't think there's another example of that kind of torturous attitude other than the scene with Lucy and Nana, unless I forgot a scene along the way.

Edit: Thank you charn; I'll read everyone's comments in a few days.

[charn (#40191)]

[Thomas(akaTammo) (#57694)]

Lucy and tortures, Charn and spoilers ;-P

[Kaj (#32327)]

I can't believe how little anime I've watched over the last few days. Time to get back into the habit I think

[xenn (#47866)]

:shock: :shock:


ooookaaayyyy,since im not crazy enought to read the novel wich you guys managed to write in surprisingly short time here,im just going to state that elfen lied sucks the big hairy one.period.

[Kaj (#32327)]

lol well done guys... we've managed to notch up like 70 posts in 3 days, half of them long enough to submit as dissertations and scaring off most normal users that comes near this thread

[Thomas(akaTammo) (#57694)]

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

[charn (#40191)]

@ Kaj, Actually what you said is quite true. Hmm.. how come there are only subjects like Shakespeare and Literature in university ? Those literature otaku must be happy teaching those stuff days in and day out. Hmmm there should be subjects like Anime studies in university. I think all of us here (Chris, Pantha, Caddberry, me, you, Thomas, rosepetals) would progress quickly from Assistant Professor to Professor.. and of course we would have no difficulty getting accepted for the position in the first place. Anyway, the Head of department position would have to be me.. ha ha because I am a thread starter..

Then this can be a 50,000 words Masters thesis - Thesis title :The substance of harem anime and the influence of nudity to enhance the popularity from consumers, with a thorough analysis on realistic and unrealistic perspective..

A : Introduction

B : What is harem anime

C : Case Studies

- Elfen Lied (this whole discussion can take the whole chapter of the thesis)
- Abenobashi mahou shotengai
- The ugly and beautiful world
- Love Hina & Futakoi
- Maid in Hanaukyo Le Verite & Onegai twins
- Sister Princess & Sister Princess Le Pure

D : Comparisons of each show's success and popularity (Source : animenfo)

E : Summary

Hmm.. sounds like a good thesis worthy of High Distinction !

I don't think the newbie would look at this thread. the newbie would be stuck in "What anime are you watching now ?" thread, or "Which anime character you want to be ?" (Oh that's my thread by the way ) They would not bother reading this deep analysis which is hidden in the anime discussion folder.

@ Thomas, Albeit it is true that I am glad everytime my thread is popular (and as you can see, 70% of my threads are reasonably popular.. getting considerable to plenty of replies), but I have not done much to make the number goes up unrealistically.. and as you can see by the vote results.. most people view things subjectively rather than objectively.

Another important thing

I am seeing a similarity between Mayu and Honda of Fruit basket that both of them are homeless yet cheerful ... i.e. they are both unrealistic characters. While I have nothing against mayu, I am so against Honda (and also I am against that overrated shit called Fruit basket) So do you guys who do not like Mayu hate Honda as well ?

My next post will be the discussion and comment of kaj's post.. but for now I am going to log out and rewrite my Maison Ikkoku review..

[Chris (#8788)]

@Kaj

Ok, for you Kaj, we can go over every part of the subject. As for everyone worried about spoilers, read the title. Blow it all out if you want. A warning sign is more then enough for vieweres not to read this thread if they don't want to be spoiled.

Animation Review

[Kaj (#32327)]

Woa! holy topic rivival, batman!

Okay, I guess I'll have to drop my anime viewing again (and my work) in order to reply to this. Hopefully this won't need to be as long as my previous posts, as I'll only need to address some of the points that you addressed to some of the points that I addressed in my original post.

I think it's also about time I learnt how to use the quote feature too, else my reply would probably be a hell of a confusing.

[Thomas(akaTammo) (#57694)]

CHRIS - OMG - Lucy's case

[Kaj (#32327)]

Oi oi oi! I object to you jumping in!!! I'm still writing out a reply. You're gonna make me look like parrot if I end up repeating what you say and I'm too lazy to "compare" answers

[Pantha (#38360)]

Argh, a lot of stuff. If I missed something, let me know.

[Chris (#8788)]

Im probley going to wait on on Kaj's response before I go up agaisn't both Thomas and Pantha. I honestly think you two missed some of my points and my post was never read fully, and most of the time I just keep repeating myself.

[Kaj (#32327)]

Okay...here we go again

[charn (#40191)]

Oh damn Pantha sama you knocked me down on the floor ! I just posted my rewrite of Maison Ikkoku review (complete makeover) so I am really exhausted at the moment. I can't think of anything to argue for now..

Yes, this discussion is coming near to an end.. but I hope all of us here who participate in this debate would still chat here in this forum.. for many other interesting discussion topics.. I certainly would.

[Kaj (#32327)]

I think it's gotten near the stage when everyone is basically repeating what they said in various different ways lol. Let me know if you see any other interesting threads lying about, charn. I don't loiter enough in the forums to pick them out. And when I do it's almost always in the feedback section.

[Rosepetals (#42525)]

I'm back a day earlier than I expected to be (and my test went well ), but i agree, most of the points now are just reinterating what was stated before. I think now I understand why Elfen Lied has so many differing interpretations, and I can see why it's disliked (as well as how much it's liked too ).

But it's all in fun of course I hope we can have more discussions like this on the forum, I'll admit I was glued to this thread for quite a while this week.

[charn (#40191)]